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Letter: No excuse for police putting wrong fuel in cars
Monday 6th June 2011, 6:00AM BST.
Letter: I found it quite incredible to read that putting the wrong fuel in police cars had cost forces in Wales almost £20,000 in three years, while Dyfed-Powys had the fewest incidents since January 2008 at 20.
Each repair cost £193, leaving a bill of £3,860.
Contrary to what the chairman of the Welsh Motoring Writers indicates, this should not be an easy mistake to make taking into account the number of diesel vehicles now used by the police service, a vast change of what it was some 20 years ago. It is nothing more than carelessness.
Compared to the police I am sure that the motoring public hardly, if ever, make this mistake due to the fact that such errors are very costly and without the permanent availability of the public purse.
It seems obvious to me that the officers of today, who do not know the meaning of “walking the beat”, have not received the necessary instruction with diesel powered vehicles.
Retired officers never had this problem to deal with, due to diesels never being used.
Should any officer be careless enough to use the wrong fuel the outcome for the individual would be a stern reprimand.
I can well recall the time when all officers had to undergo a police driving course before being allowed behind the wheel, which included driving ability and basic mechanical knowledge.
Bernard Jones
Powys
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What a pointless rant! I’ll bite anyway.
It’s a relatively easy mistake to make, especially if the officers making it normally drive a petrol vehicle (i.e. their own car).
The motoring public hardly make this mistake because they don’t switch between cars regularly.
I wonder what “training” in the use of a diesel pump would entail and how much it would cost?
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How much police time (that we pay for) is wasted by them pulling up for petrol and not realising the petrol cap is on the other side from on their own car ?
They have to walk all the way round the car. It’s a disgrace.
Don’t they know there is a little arrow symbol on their dashboard ?
They simply haven’t done the training.
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I have two cars,one diesel,one petrol, the fuel fillers are both on the offside.
The location of the fuel filler is normally down to the country of manufacture, most continental cars have their fillers on the offside, so your rantings are quite baseless.
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It wasn’t a rant, it was sarcasm at the original ranting letter. I’d have thought that was obvious but ho-hum…..
However, if you look at the petrol gauge on your car you will notice that next to the petrol pump symbol there is a large triangle shape, otherwise known as an arrow. This points in the direction that the petrol filler is accessible from. This is so people who regularly use hire cars don’t spend their lives in utter confusion. As an idea it was originally introduced by Ford (I think) but in now in wide-spread use (although not 100%). NB I am *not* referring to the side the petrol pump symbol has it’s hose on, but the large arrow.
This & other useful tips can be found in the car owners manual.
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Now thats sarcasm
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Of course if people carried out a predriving drill and checked where everything is in the vehicle you wouldn’t have to wait at the pumps whilst Mr & Mrs Reginald Molehusband moved the car so that the pump nozzle would finally stretch to the filler.
How many times have you jumped in a car with someone who is busy looking around the cabin for a switch or control yet they think that’s it’s appropriate to immediately put the car through a set of bends at 60mph without having any experience of the vehicles handling characteristics?
PS
My £35,000 car hasn’t an arrow on the fuel gauge, should I send it back or just learn where the filler is?
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My car’s petrol gauge doesn’t have an arrow but I think it’s a great idea so I have drawn one on the gauge with red crayon. I’d use a pencil but I’m not allowed sharp objects.
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No arrow on my dashboard either.
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If there isn’t an arrow there’s a fuel pump or fuel cap symbol – the one which indicates ‘this is the fuel gauge’
And it’s on the same side as the fuel cap.
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Most cars do – as I say, not 100% but most.
The arrow is not glaringly obvious – it’s a bit like the Toblerlone symbol really being a bear not a mountain, in other words it can be staring you in the face and you just haven’t seen it.
Look at the petrol gauge. See the petrol pump symbol. Look next to the petrol pump symbol. If there is a triangle, it points to the side of the car that the filler cap is on.
Fords have it, Nissans have it and that’s to my knowledge, it’s a lot more widespread than those two manufacturers.
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If it reads diesel on the filler cap, then they should concentrate and put diesel in.
If they make this “easy mistake” what other areas of their work do they carry out in a shoddy slapdash manner?
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This is my experience.
The pool car I was driving that day was a large silver grey hatchback that was diesel powered. My private car at that time was a large silver grey hatchback that was petrol driven.
I got to the end of the M54 before the pool car, now sucking on petrol, gave protest & stopped. My employers were very good about it all. They did not pass the £600 bill on to me from the dealer.
All that was a couple of years ago.
Earlier this year, I changed my large silver grey hatch that was petrol driven for a large silver grey hatch that is diesel powered.
To prevent reoccurrence of fuel swap I have employed this simple and quick routine.
1.Actually touch the pump you are about to select the nozzle from. Touch with a finger the word DIESEL.
2.Actually touch the filler nozzle. Again touch the word DIESEL.
3.Actually touch the filler cap. Actually touch the word DIESEL.
4.Only when you have identified the word DIESEL three times do you enter the nozzle into the tank filler & squeeze.
Fellow ‘bloggers’ are free to ridicule me as they feel fit to do so. What I know is ultimately I am doing all I can to prevent the next £600 bill for cross filling being mine! I was lucky last time!
Incidentally, petrol engined drivers need not feel left out. Simply replace DIESEL where it is written in 1 – 4 with PETROL and there you have it! Enjoy.
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Joe Public do indeed make the same mistake at an alarming rate – the AA quote figures of 150,000 UK motorists each year (1 every 3.5 minutes) (source: http://www.theaa.com/motoring_advice/news/aa-fuel-assist-contaminated-fuel-recycled.html)
It’s very easily done especially if your private vehicle takes one type, and your work vehicle takes another. But as well as costly, it’s an embarrassing mistake to make. I suspect that following a severe ribbing from his/her colleagues, they’ll never do it more than once.
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There are no courses in common sense. Please do not devise yet another “training course” which removes the requirement and consequently the ability to think for yourself (and creates yet more non-jobs which we have to pay for). The police may not realise it but they do foot the bill for these repairs through their taxes. It is not the government’s money – it is ours.
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“Compared to the police I am sure that the motoring public hardly, if ever, make this mistake…”
Sorry Mr Jones but you are entirely and utterly wrong. The AA estimates that over 150,000 drivers put the wrong fuel in their car every year. They work out that a misfueling incident takes place every three and a half minutes.
What a pointless rant and based on no evidence at all! What could he have against the police?
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Certain animals are trained to seek out truffles! Maybe a sense of smell capable of detecting alcohol at 100 yards is not able to differentiate between petrol and diesel.
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Everybody must be so perfect and mistake free in Bernardland..
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Well, when the IQ needed to be a copper is less than that of a petrol station attendant what do you expect?
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What a ridiculous, immature comment Andy. And what job do you do in comparison?
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Design weapons and defense systems to deter aggressors…
your point being?
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Stop typing to yourself
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Well done, so you dont deal with the general public every day and deal with drugs, motoring offences, abuse, drunk people, vulnerable people, dangerous people etc… My point being, do some research before submitting comments like this!
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Andy,
If your IQ is so much higher than a copper, you might have used the correct spelling of ‘defence’…
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Well said Peter perhaps Andy should concentrate more himself :-)
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The culprit should be made to pay for it out of their own pocket, when our reps make this mistake they pay to fix it and trust me, they never do it twice!
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With police pay cuts that probably wont happen!
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I find it more of a worry when they put the wrong people in jail!
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The police don’t put people in jail …. they don’tg even prosecute in most cases – that’s what the CPS do. Magistrates and judges put people in jail.
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Whoooo, 20 mistakes in a year !!! maybe not brilliant but the AA say they deal with 150,000 of their members who do the same each year …. and thats with people using their own car who really should know better !!! and without the figures from the RAC and Green Flag, plus those who arent in a breakdown club.
Ohh I do love all this police bashing, generally by people without the where to do or bravery to do the job themselves ….
Aren’t we all wonderful and of course we could all do the job better …… except for the endless paperwork, unsocial hours, constant battles against a system tainted in favour of the criminals and against victims, dealing with endless numbers of drunk or drugged up people trying to kill each other, pulling mashed up dead bodies out of crashed cars or off railway lines, looking for missing 3 year old kids, trying to comfort granny who’s just had some light fingered moron pretending to be from the water board nick all her life savings ….. ohh yes we can all do that without a gripe !!!
Get a life people, if we all took a bit more effort to put more into our communitiies they would be better places … it’s not always someone eles job you know !!
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No, we couldnt do the job of a policeman/woman better, but apparently we know more about filling cars up with fuel than they do!
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oooh, bottom of the barrel mate!
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Shropman, at last, someone who realises some of the actual jobs that the police do! I do realise that some half brains will type anything to make derogatory comments about police, though they are soon quick enough to ring the number when they need them.
Also look at police pay, £36000 pa for top pc compared with £100,000 a week (yes, on average) for a top footballer. This world is corrupt and upside down!! (I’ll get off my soap box now!)
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What do you expect from that useless lot that we call the Police.
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Feel free to join the police to make them better then…..
……….or just be quiet if you’re too lazy or busy.
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Please feel free to provide some constructive, evidential, fact based information to support your argument …….
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I did, with names and references, but apparently the shropshire star is a little squeamish about our boys in blue… so three words:
Menezes
Tomlinson
Somerville
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All very, very bad cases I agree, however hardly indicitive of our police nationally I would counter.
Whilst we were on that subject though, what about:
Toms
Cooper
Barker
Carroll
Oake
Our very own Richard Gray
Pratt
Gorman
Green
Irvine
Magee
Howe
Terry
Hart
all killed in the line of duty in the last few years doing nothing but the job most of us would never dare to …. are they all a ‘useless lot’ as well ????
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Shropsman. The Police do not pull mashed and dead bodies from vehicles or raliways, that is left for the Fireman and Ambulance people. The same goes when they need to retrieve a body from the river.The useless Police just close the road that’s their total involvement. Their excuse is H/S.
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let’s not forget the incidents of bobbies using h&s excuses to justify standing by while children drown.
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Well that’s wrong for a start. When the big gas explosion happened in town, who risked their lives to go into the wreckage to rescue trapped people first???
Yes, it was the Police.
I don’t know what the police have done to personally annoy you enough that you now appear to have a grudge, but I think you need to get over it.
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“The same goes when they need to retrieve a body from the river”
From personal experience factually INCORRECT…
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Waterboy8535, Sorry, I’m retired. The Police over the last 30 years have turned into Social Workers and prefer to spend their shift in a car or office, anything to get out of catching criminals which is what we pay them to do.
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The police are there in the offices creating paperwork to appease the CPS and defence solicitors (who if you think about it previously got paid more if there’s more to read). A prosecution file could normally be knocked up in about 30 mins, now it’s 4 hrs if you’re lucky,sometimes it goes into days even weeks.
On the point of officers in cars they are there because of one reason if they don’t get to Mrs Miggins report of children playing catch on a ‘no ball games’ area within 6.87 secs then she (a) complains to the police heirarchy and (b) goes whinging to the local rag and radio station.
A seasoned officer prefers to go on foot,because when they are they don’t have much work to contend with, if you can’t get to it within the target time somebody else ,paid less than you, deals with it,simples.
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If you are retired then do something constructive instead of (again) making degrogatory comments about police. I am sure that before you retired, you helped people and risked your life every day. Then again, maybe not. Also, how do police “get out” of catching criminals? It is all based on evidence as well as other factors. Finally, you say that that is what “we” pay them to do. I am sure that police officers pay taxes as well……..
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If the car makers made the petrol filler and the pump triangular and the diesel filler round no mistakes.One would not fit the othere.simple squeek!!!
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Waterboy8535, In my reply to Shropsman I said out of crashed cars or the river, it was not only the police that responded to the explosion the general public were also involved as they were first on the scene. And yes I have a grudge against the Police,they do not do the job that they are paid to do, ie. uphold the law of the land. When you have 2 sergeants telling you that it is not an offence to park on the pavement, you quote the relevant laws to them they still don’t act, so if you are disabled and have to use a wheel chair or are blind then hard luck.
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So you can park on the pavement but not cycle?
is that what they are saying??
in our town, the police station has a phone outside the door, you dial a station 35 miles away, so they can call the station your stood outside to see if they will let you in. Not good if you need to get in urgently!!
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“Not good if you need to get in urgently!”
Have you tried ringing 999??!!??
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yes but all they do is redirect you to phone the second station so they can call the first one!
I have tried that!
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the point i am trying to make Mr Magoo, is just that you should be able to walk into a Police Station, and not have to call another town’s station to let you in.
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It isn’t an offence to park on the pavement. Unless you are causing an unnessecary obstruction, which is illegal.
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I think the police do a good job in general and how it ie the job has developed over the years they adhere to it.Lots of money is wasted, ie cso is one that should be scrapped, paper work is needed and needs to be spot on you cant have police officers nicking someone and then walking off in to the sunset looking for a another criminal.
Police as far as I am aware appear after a crime has been committed and the the main role is then for them to solve it, so my view is the only figures to look at are “”crime solved figures”.
As for the letter once is a mistake it is hoped any further mistakes are dealt with a little more severely as it costs the tax payer.
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I’ve thought of a foolproof solution.
If you intend to purchase a diesel car, order a black one. If you intend to purchase a petrol car, order a green one. That way you can simply match the colour of the hose to the colour of your car.
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Except some fuel hoses are yellow…..
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I like!!!!!
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Kelly, Sorry wrong, you sound like a WPC, please refer to the following.
1) Highways Act 1988 section 34, sub. sec.1(b)
2) Road Vehicles Construction And Use
Regulations 1986, reg. 103.
3) Paragraph 34(1) of the Road Traffic Act 1988, makes It an offence to drive a motor vehicle on common land, mooor land, other land which is not a road or a footpath or bridleway, unless there is lawful authority,this has been the situation since 1930.Your police station should have the relevant books.
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John Jones, sorry you are wrong I’m afraid. In your point three you will note the key word is DRIVE. Read further you will find it is not an offence to drive a vehicle off the carriageway no more than 15 metres for the purpose of parking.
Also, from the Department of Transport website :
“Under section 19 of the Road Traffic Act 1988, Heavy Goods Vehicles (HGVs) are banned from parking on the pavement, although section 19 is subject to a number of exemptions: in particular, an HGV may be parked on the pavement when loading/unloading is taking place.
In London, pavement parking is banned by the Greater London Council (General Powers) Act 1974, although within London there are some areas where exemptions are indicated with traffic signs.
Pavement parking is also banned in other locations around the country including Exeter and Peterborough. Nationwide, the police are able to take action when a vehicle parked on the pavement is deemed to be causing an obstruction or is parked dangerously.
There is currently no national legislation banning the parking of all vehicles on the pavement, due to the wide range of circumstances and locations where pavement parking occurs. For example in some narrow residential roads with a lack of off-street parking provision, drivers have little option but to park on the pavement to avoid causing traffic hazards. The Government has no plans at present to introduce new legislation specifically aimed at banning pavement parking on a national scale.
As with most elements of traffic management, local authorities have the power under the Road Traffic Regulations Act 1984 to make Traffic Regulation Orders, allowing for specific parking regulations to be implemented in specific areas, according to the demands of local circumstances. Local authorities can for example introduce a Traffic Regulation Order in a single road banning the parking of vehicles on any part of the pavement (these bans must be indicated with traffic signs), whilst a range of other methods can be used to manage pavement parking, including the introduction of bollards and heightened kerbs.”
A bit more research on motoring group websites will fill you with cases of how people have got off tickets issued for ‘causing an unncessary obstruction’ pavement parking because the courts say it is a subjective matter … one persons obstruction is another persons clearway.
The only way pavement parking is a specific offence now is it the local authority passes an order or byelaw, not sure about Shrewsbury/Shropshire Council but Telford & Wrekin certainly haven’t. Your grudge lies with them, not the police who as I’m sure your further research will by now have shown you, have to interpret sometimes awful (from the point of the general public) legislation.
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Aarrggghhh sorry forgot this bit also form the DoT website:
The definition of a road in England and Wales is ‘any highway and any other road to which the public has access and includes bridges over which a road passes’ (RTA 1988 sect 192(1)). In Scotland, there is a similar definition which is extended to include any way over which the public have a right of passage (R(S)A 1984 sect 151(1)).
It is important to note that references to ‘road’ therefore generally include footpaths, bridleways and cycle tracks, and many roadways and driveways on private land (including many car parks).
- – - – - -
So according to British law, parking on the pavement (without a specific order to stop you) is parking on the road.
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Thanks Shropsman.
WPC’s don’t exist anymore. I’m a Civil Engineer, if it’s important.
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You may find this link helpful:
http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/+/http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roads/tpm/tmaportal/tmafeatures/tmapart6/secparkingfactsheets/parkingonpavements
“There is currently no national legislation banning the parking of all vehicles on the pavement, due to the wide range of circumstances and locations where pavement parking occurs. For example in some narrow residential roads with a lack of off-street parking provision, drivers have little option but to park on the pavement to avoid causing traffic hazards. The Government has no plans at present to introduce new legislation specifically aimed at banning pavement parking on a national scale.”
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Kelly, I did place a very lengthy reply (which is why my additional bit above sounds disjointed) which included the info you just posted and much more on current parking legislation. Unfortunately it has not been posted for some reason ….. The short and curlies were though that outside London, pavement (or most other off road) parking is no longer an offence unless the local authority makes a specific regulation order … which hasn’t happened round here.
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And some people wonder why the unsolved crime rate is so high – what a shower!
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Tom
Enlighten us to the rate of unsolved crime as you are so knowledgeable…
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I note your annoyance and disillusion with the competence of the modern day police officer Johnjones, however I question your idea about what a police officer, Sgt or otherwise should be spending their time doing. If your main concern in life is the fact that someone is parking on a pavement then you obviously live in a very safe and enjoyable community, which I presume is partly down to good policing. I see in the news people being murdered, raped and burgled on a daily basis in any number of cities in the UK, yet your only gripe with the police is that they do not sort out parking issues. I’m sure you are aware that most parking enforcement is now the responsibility of the local council/authority and they employ private companies to enforce this. No doubt youy response will be that there are murders/rapes etc in Shropshire, but before you do please resarch the relevant detection figures compared to other forces, and then come back with a constructive informed response. I feel lucky to live in a community policed by West Mercia.
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Sorry!!! I should have mentioned the following. I have been in touch with Shropshire Council,and they said, parking on the pavement is a criminal offence dealt with by the local Police and not by their people.
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Since when have Shropshire Council know what they are doing!!
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Although I am normally the first to pounce on the Police and have a good rant about them and I confess that I normally feel better afterwards – on this occasion I feel very honoured that the majority of the educated people on here are full of logistical prowess and oh so obviously have never made an entire mistake in their whole life.
I guess these prime species of human beings have never locked their keys in their car, lost their keys in their house, forgotten to put on an alarm and woken up late or given a wrong credit card when paying a bill.
Call me a muppet but I have twice filled my car up with petrol when it is a disel. I hire about 30 cars in foreign countries a year and in the UK and Europe drive usually about 45,000+ miles a year.
I too have DISEL stickers inside the cap but I have still committed the crime of the century and filled up with petrol.
Ill stand in the corner of the room then and think about the error of my ways and will gladly serve a 25 yr prison spell for committing crime of the century.
Keyboard warring at the highest level me thinks.
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Thank you Shropsman, what you and Kelly have read is a D.O.T. Information site and not a legal site. The main problem seems to be “obstruction” So the question is “when is an obstruction not an obstruction”? Where I live on Heath Farm the road is wide enough for two large vehicles to pass each other, the pavement is five feet wide, if a vehicle parks on the pavement say half way, this leaves two feet six inches to get by, a single person, yes, a woman with a single buggy, yes, a wheelchair, no, a double buggy, no, a blind man, no. In 2009 in Shrewsbury there were forty four fixed penalty tickets, for unnecessary obstruction twenty of these tickets were issued for parking on the pavement, I have also had figures from both the Lancashire police and Cheshire police. The laws that I have referred to are still in force and have not been removed. Believe it or not but this old law made before motor cars is also still on the books.
Town Police Clauses Act. 1847. Section 28.
Researching all this is very confusing, so have we got a legal mind out there that can help with the answers?
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