PRH downgrade — your views
Tuesday 22nd September 2009, 6:57PM BST.
Today the Shropshire Star reveals that Telford’s Princess Royal Hospital is set to lose its acute clinical services, most of its accident and emergency department and be downgraded — and we want to know what you think about it.
Councillor Andrew Eade says services are going to be moved to the Royal Shrewsbury Hospital.
He has written to health bosses condemning the plans.
A joint statement from Shropshire County PCT, NHS Telford and Wrekin and the Shrewsbury and Telford hospital NHS Trust said: “We have reviewed all of the options for 2012/13 and 2020 and carried out non financial and financial appraisals and the results of this will be considered at board meetings in September.
“No decisions have been taken and any proposals would of course have to be made subject to public consultation.
“The key concern is to ensure clinically safe services are provided across the county.”
- We want to consult you on the Princess Royal Hospital before health bosses do. Tell us you experiences of the hospital, what it did for you, and what the loss of services would mean.
- Tell us YOUR FULL NAME and give us your views in the comment box below.
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And how is a Borough with a population well in excess of 200,000 supposed to function with these services over 20 miles away? We’ll be back to the bad old days of anyone taken ill in from East Shropshire dying in the back of an ambulance on the A5.
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Quite simply; if the PRH didn’t have an A&E service 6 years ago I would have died on route to the RSH.
I would have been one of those dead in the back of an ambulance on the A5. But nevermind, I would only have been a statistic!
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See, you elect the Tories in Telford & see what happens!
Wait till they win the general election, then you’ll loose everything else that Labour has built!
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As ever, it’s postcode apartheid. The RSH has to be retained at all costs in a small town with 60,000 residents because it caters for mid Wales as well. This is the same Wales where prescription charges are a thing of the past while we, in England, pay £7.20 a time. So a few dozen people in mid Wales come first over 200,000 plus in East Shropshire. Typical Labour doctrine – appease the few and offend the majority of the population.
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Bloody Stupid
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It is not very often that I agree with the thoughts of H.St.John Peasbody – but this time he is 100% correct.
As for Telblue, what a cheap political shot, perhaps the NHS is starting the cutbacks that Brown is suggesting, in order to pay for the massive debt that LABOUR has landed this country with.
It will be interesting Telblue to see what the Local Labour MP thinks of this, he will probably say as much as he has in the post on Government policy which amounts to ZERO/nothing/spineless
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How stupid is this? We have to have an A&E closer than SHREWSBURY to cover such a large community, my Husband suffers with Angina and we have had a few near misses, heaven knows what would happen if we had to travel to Shrewsbury, whether by car or ambulance, its too risky for anyone with a serious health problem.jUST LEAVE tELFORD ALONE, IF IT AINT BROKE DONT FIX IT!
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Same old Story what Shrewsbury wants Shrewsbury gets, I wonder where most of the consultants and Board Members live ???
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ITs complete madness having two councils running two major hospitals – it allows the bean-counters to swing this way and that – moving services here and then there in another few years. It needs some clever work by the two councils to make it one hospital with two locations. Lock things in one organsiation – havent we got video conferencing now for meetings! Keep those who sell business advice out, the sell one thing and then, in a short time another.. its a leach on the whole of Shropshire’s local taxes T&W and ShropU .. get together on this.
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Labour voters, give youselves a pat on the back !
This is just a continuation of the “pay more – get less” government.
Lets get these clowns out and vote in someone who dares to represent the interests of the English.
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I think this is stupid idea like others have said if its not broke dont fix it. We have a good A&e dept in PRH if people are expected to travel from Telford to Shrewbury how many miles away dont you think that thisis going to push the mortality rate up. If there was no need for PRH to have an A&E Dept then why (as Laurence say’s 6years ago PRH did not have an A&E) did they get one there must be a need for it dont you think?????
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here we are again – let see if we can make it with a heart attack from Newport to Shrewsbury or Stafford in time to still be alive.
Telford can not lose A and E people will die as a result – this decision will have blood on peoples hands – literally!
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Let us consider a few hard, cold facts that will become a reality if this latest piece of bureacratic nonsense becomes a reality.
On blue lights it will take an ambulance an extra 20 minutes to get a Telford patient to hospital – PEOPLE WILL DIE
Telford people needing to attend A&E by car will take an extra 20 minutes to get there – THEY WILL CALL AN AMBULANCE MORE FREQUENTLY – what was tolerable for the 5 minute journey by car to the PRH to get help will not be tolerable for the extra 20 minutes
Ambulances will be queued up at the RSH and will take 20 minutes to get back to Telford – FEWER AMBULANCES, LONGER RESPONSE TIMES – MORE DEATHS
If the Police in Telford have to take a arrested to person to the RSH it will involve an extra 40 minutes travelling time – FEWER POLICE IN TELFORD, LONGER RESPONSE TIMES, MORE CRIME, PEOPLE WILL DIE
Telford is a growing town – more people – worse service – more people will die
The power goes off at the RSH or there is a serious fire in A&E and services are not available – PEOPLE WILL DIE
How long will it be before the lunatics take this plan to the next stage – centralise all hospital services for the UK in Milton Keynes and we all travel there – why not do it on a european basis and we all travel to Bulgaria for treatment – a daft idea yes, but so is this current plan.
To raise one other thought – what is all this extra travelling going to do for global warming – assuming of course that it really exists!!
Perhaps this is the governments way of tackling the pensions crisis – more deaths, fewer pensioners, and so more money to go around – if of course you are still alive!
I do hope common sense will prevail but I won’t be holding my breath.
We must all stand up and fight these ridiculous ideas – will the Shropshire Star be publishing the names and home addresses of all those involved in making these decisions so we can take the fight direct to them – or are you not that community spirited?
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Surely population and need should determine where these services should be not just tradition. Again, it’s another case of Shrewsbury wants so Shrewsbury gets. How come services aren’t being cut there? Which site isn’t paying their way?
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Well said ” Back to Reality ” I am 25 and have a heart condition if I had a heart attack I would more than likely end up dead or with lasting problems (not including the ones I have now). Has no one thought about the waiting times as well?? I am sure that they will go up and out the window. Come on people I think this is stupid silly and NOT thought out at all. Get your head out the clouds in the live in the real world.
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My two-year-old son was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes last November, and was in intensive care – in Telford initially – as a result. From there, he was transferred to Alder Hey hospital.
Had the ambulance have had to go to Shrewsbury and not Telford, there’s every chance he could have died, as in retrospect, we’ve been told it was “touch and go” and any longer he’d have really been struggling.
The A and E department, along with the children’s ward, saved his life that day. I dread to think about an extra 15 miles to travel to a decent hospital!!!
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Errr… unless I’ve read it wrong, no decision has been made and there will be consulatation on any proposals? Is this really something to get so worked up about?
Please, Shrewsbury gets what Shrewsbury wants??? When did the population of Shrewsbury get a vote on where they wanted A&E services?
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There can’t be many occasions wheen all the regular posters on this site agree but this is one onf them
Close A&E at the PRH and PEOPLE WILL DIE – this is not scaremongering but solid fact
The difference in travelling time between PRH and RSH is between 15-20 minutes – would you care to be undergoing life saving medical procedures in the back of a van hurtling down the M54 and A5 ???? – I wouldn’t !!!!
How much extra pressure and stress must this farcical plan put on the already overworked yet marvellously professional ambulanc ecrews and A&E staff at the other end ???
According to the latest availaable reliable statistics, the 2001 Census, the total population of Shropshire as a county was 441,498; of these 158,325 lived in Telford and Wrekin and 95,850 in Shrewsbury and Atcham. the other 187,323 are spread throughout the rural areas so some will be nearer to Telford, some nearer to Shrewsbury.
What we do know is that the Government has planned a 40% increase to the population of Telford based on regional development plans – on 2001′s figures thats an extra 63,330 people coming in to the new town putting Teflord’s population somewhere near double that of S&A.
Research also suggests that poverty and poor living standards increase the likelihood of needin hospital treatment – far more prevelant in T&W than S&A !!!
Maybe I should stop this common sense thinking but on that basis, SHUT THE RSH – statistically there is far more demand for services at the PRH !!!!
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Ever since the 2 hospitals merged things have been moving to Shrewsbury!
Shrewsbury is that clicky that PRH never stood a chance.
With the amount of people in Telford we need an A&E or RSH will get overwelmed and it becomes dangerous!!
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How stupid can someone be to want to do this.The hospital can’t cope now with the number of patients it has, it need making bigger not downsized. Telford is getting biger by the day and some stuid little person with no brain wants to make its services smaller.
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What are the chances that this is another example of the Shropshire Star making a story where there isn’t one? Read the piece:-
“results of this will be considered at board meetings in September”. “No decisions have been taken and any proposals would of course have to be made subject to public consultation”.
Another example of Daily Mail, sorry – Shropshire Star, Tory Bigotry
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This shouldn’t even be being considered. With Telford’s existing size and planned growth plus the poor state of many of the buildings at the RSH should lead to the opposite. As the facilities at the RSH age they should be being replaced at the PRH where the greatest need will be.
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Steve,
Steve,
Obviously those in charge will listen to whatever the people tell them. As they will with the Wrekin mining application and all
roads/housing applications.
I mean, it’s not as if these things are ever a foregone conclusion.
Still, you carry on and shoot the messenger.
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Telford people fought for years to get a proper hospital for the town, but it seems to have been under threat virtually since it opened.
Others have already commented that Telford has by far the fastest growing population and birthrate in Shropshire, with massive expansion planned over the next few years (more than the rest of Shropshire combined), so how the hell can the Hospital Trust justify these proposals?
I’m not a Tory supporter (and I think the NHS is equally at risk whichever party wins the next election), but well done to Andrew Eade for expressing concern about an issue that affects everyone in Telford.
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Let’s see first of all whether this is a genuine threat to services, or a piece of political mischief-making. At present we have only the word of one Tory councillor that there’s a problem at all…
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I cannot believe some of the ridiculously childish comments made on here.
It should be obvious to anyone with an ounce of common sense that the main issue here is that BOTH hospitals are needed.
PRH is needed for all the quite valid points made above.
And the RSH is needed otherwise instead of people dying on the A5 on the way from telford to the RSH, they will be dying on the A5 on there way to the PRH !
So come on people this don’t turn this into a Telford vs Shrewsbury load of tripe.
The issues at stake here are more important than that.
And BTW, no I don’t live anywhere near Shrewsbury, I can just see the wood for the trees.
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Crazy Decision.
Shrewsbury A&E cannot cope as it is. On Sunday there was a QUEUE outside A&E just to get to the reception desk. No seating available anywhere. Minimum 3hours wait..
SORT IT OUT BEAN COUNTERS….
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“Another example of Daily Mail, sorry – Shropshire Star, Tory Bigotry”
Seconded.
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I agree with Neil (#26).
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It wont happen
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Well said Rob of Telford. I was one of the people who voted for our hospital and a lot of people worked hard for it to be built,like you said why should we have to travel all the way to salop.
I for one am to old at 76yrs old to go all that way.so let us keep on at the idiots who want to close it and give them a very guilty feeling every time its mentioned.
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Here we go again. we can cry and bang our heads against the wall, but it will go ahead, it always will. people will die, but those fatheads in the labour party who sit in their ivory towers and havent a blood clue about the real world, see the £’s shillings and pence they will save – to hell with the real people who will suffer because of this. get rid before any more lives are lost.
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I also agree with Neil
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Many years ago I was at a public meeting just prior to the PRH being started. A Shrewsbury member of the health board was heard to say: “We don’t want or need a hospital in Telford! The money should be spent at Copthorne!”
Interesting that all the Labour Party drones have decided to comment. Rather a curious bunch. They’d rather attack a Conservative councillor than defend hospital services in Telford. Pathetic.
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it is pure madness to even think about reducing services at princess royal is a modern hospital with modern buildings and wards and shrewsbury is now showing its age and will need money spending on the building wasting more money which is short in supply as it is.. let the protests begin to save all the services in telford area why should we risk lives just to save money
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Poor telblue. It is people like you that talk such rubbish that has got us all into this terrible mess. Do you not remember someone called Holmer who ran up a debt for the PRH of millions of pounds. He was a Labour councilor I believe.
What the Tories in Telford have got to do with the PRH I do not know.
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Split the 2 hospitals up so Telford & Shrewsbury fund there own hospitals as before the takeover ( sorry merger )and have 2 hospital boards as before with inter hospital coperation
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All we have is the word from a Tory Leader of Telford who is struggling to keep his position, that the PRH is under threat, no doubt Mark “Jump on the Bandwagon” Pritchard will be next. No proposals have yet been made, and when they do and it is detrimental to the people of Shropshire no matter where they live, then we have the opportunity to oppose and oppose we should if the PRH is downgraded.
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I have my doubts about the legitimacy of this ‘news’ story.
It seems only to come from Tory news sources – one being Andrew Eade, and the other being Mark Pritchard, who is mentioned in the short BBC Shropshire news article.
Interestingly this latter article states that what is being suggested is “The NHS is considering moving the most serious accident and emergency cases from Princess Royal Hospital, Telford, to the Royal Shrewsbury Hospital.”
So this might be being considered on medical, rather than cost grounds alone. It certainly doesn’t suggest that A & E in Telford will close.
As I said in an earlier comment – let’s wait and see. The sceptic in me wonders if either the Star has allowed itself to be manipulated for political ends, or whether they’re simply running out of UFO stories.
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Please see today’s story: http://www.shropshirestar.com/2009/09/18/prh-axe-is-best-move/
Andrew Owen
Shropshire Star
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With a husband who refuses to be treated at the PRH and not living near to either hospital, it doesn’t matter to us whether or not the PRH is downgraded. However, Telford does need an acute hospital to serve it’s growing population.
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PRH has the larger population base, when the rural areas are added in – and by far the greatest growth potential – this move appears to be timed now before the balance in population would suggest the closure of RSH. There are reports in the public domain that suggest services should be moved to Telford and not Shrewsbury.
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With the rapidly increasing population of Telford this plans makes no sense what so ever.
I can’t believe for one minute that the primary care trust would be able to get away with such a severe cut to Telford services.
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I think everyone can agree that both should stay open but as the local NHS seem bent on turning it into a ‘one or the other’ situation we will have to prove that the PRH and the residents of east Shropshire should not be made to suffer.
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Here we go again. trying to save money is more important than lives!! They havent got a clue.i cant even start to say how pathetic it is. I work there in a “front line|” department, and people only just make it from a couple of miles away – never mind 20 minutes away! when are they going to learn. PEOPLE WILL DIE – but dont worry they will save money!!!
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Part of me wants to say wait and see but part of me knows the report may well be true. The people of Shrewsbury are not to blame any more than Telford residents are at fault. But politicians and NHS managers have a lot to answer to. I remember the RSH (or Copthorne as it was) in the 1970s when A&E was clogged with county wide patients who would then find – through no fault of their own – that they were many miles from home. Telford deserves the full services of a general hospital and anything less is wrong.
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Setting aside the emotional rhetoric for a moment, recent meetings in Oakengates and other locations have already provided the reasons WHY Telford must lose many of these services – the South Staffs NHS Trust and Keele University Medical School will provide additional funding for ONE centre only. Regrettably, the rather cynical question of “where do the majority of consultants /directors live?” has already been answered -Shrewsbury.
Mr Leaman and his A and E colleagues perform sterling work, but are aware of the political implications. One would be hesitant to suggest this is simply another way of pressurising T and WC and the PCT to provide more cash………… Oh dear, there goes my cynical head again!
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“Another example of Daily Mail, sorry – Shropshire Star, Tory Bigotry”
…Thirded
Rob Said
“I’m not a Tory supporter (and I think the NHS is equally at risk whichever party wins the next election), but well done to Andrew Eade for expressing concern about an issue that affects everyone in Telford.”
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Oh dear!! All those people saying “Wait and see what decision is made!” are living in the dark. These are the facts (I know from being inside!) Telford PRH A&E sees more patients than RSH A&E. Women in labour from Telford are ‘blue-lighted’ from Telford to Shrewsbury on a daily basis as there is only mid-wife cover at PRH. Got a gynaecological problem you need to be shipped off to RSH in an ambulance. Bleeding nose that won’t stop, you guessed it RSH. Facial injury, RSH again. The list goes on.
Wake up and smell the coffee, despite Telford being the largest town by far, with the less affluent population resulting in poor health, higher number of pregnancies, RSH will always be put above PRH. The only time Telford comes before Shrewsbury is in the name.
It’s about time we told RSH where to go, if we don’t get a fair deal we can vote with our feet and insist on being seen at New Cross (their new Heart and Lung centre far excels anything RSH can offer for a start!!) and for some people in Teford and Wrekin it’s closer. Didn’t Tony Blair say that the money should follow the patient!! 180,000+ (that’s more than live in mid-wales that use RSH)people turning their backs on some pompous directors who wanted PRH strangled at birth would cost a lot of money;-)
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Mark Pritchard was right, though, wasn’t he?
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This is dreadful scaremongering from Andrew Eade no doubt in conjunction with Mr Bandwagon himself Mark Pritchard. Shame on you Shropshire Star for helping stir up fear before any proposals have even been announced or consultation started. Make the most of it, you’ll be a weekly paper within 12 months, I have that on good authority.
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been thinking about his, it’s not the trip to A&E that would cause more to die, as long as we have enough emergency responders & paramedics close by to stabalise the the patient in an emergency the distance of the A&E Dept being an extra 20min away isn’t going to cause more people to die….. On the other hand, I live in Telford & don’t want to loose local services & will be out there demonstrating about this in the coming weeks for sure!
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Why do people always start with the Shrews v Telford argument. Both areas need an A&E, we should all be sticking together and saying this. RSH covers a very large area, we travel over to Shrewsbury from Bishops Castle for A&E treatment. Close this and we have to go even further to Telford. Both departments are too busy, there is always a long wait so please keep them open.
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Merk,
To be fair, I think you’ll find that ‘Mr Bandwagon’ is Daniel Kawczynski. Mark Pritchard is but a pretender…
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JJ, I feel sad for you and the population of Bishops Castle. The people of Telford never wanted to see RSH A&E closed, unfortunately you’ve been caught in the crossfire. When Daniel Kawyczynski the MP for Shrewsbury makes comments like “My priority is RSH”"We are the county town and the most important centre in the county, if any resources are protected then they must always be at the RSH” and you know that is how the board of directors think, is it any wonder that the people of Telford and Wrekin get annoyed. We are sick and tired of this condescending attitude!!!
If PRH lost its 24 hour consultant led A&E it would be the largest town in the UK by far without an A&E (Crawley with a population of just under 100,000 in 2001 is the largest at the moment).
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As anyone who has attended either A&E unit knows, both are in serious need of investment and upgrading and of course this is why the Trust may want to focus on developing one site.
The fact that Telford is the more accessible site not just for the majority of the population residentially but also for the majority by employment location should weigh in terms of its being the major A&E unit although there must continue to be a facility at the present level in Shrewsbury.
If there is a need to change what is provided at which site to make economies then the priorities should be something like (I’m sure I may have missed something)
At BOTH sites:
- A&E with Telford being the larger unit
- Intensive & critical care
- Cardio-thoracic
- Orthopaedic (trauma only)
- Maternity
- Paediatric
- Dialysis and other ongoing care
- Haematology
- ENT
At ONE site only
- Each of the elective surgery disciplines(i.e. split by disciplines between the sites)
- Day surgery
- Oncology
- Geriatric
Perhaps the answer, instead of building a new A&E unit somewhere along the old A5, as was once suggested, is to build a new hospital near Atcham which deals solely with elective surgery and ongoing care such as oncology and geristric?
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If Telford is the fastest growing connurbation in the West Mids, why aren’t the facilities at the PRH being expanded and upgraded? I know that the bureaucrats will try and dress this idea of a reconsolidation of resources up as the “Emporers New Clothes”, but their presumption that we’re all stupid just rubs salt in the wound. They want to cut back what the PRH currently offers and I consider that to be completely unacceptable. We must not allow it to happen.
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I am a Shrewsbury resident and agree totally with all the comments PRH needs to retain a fully operational A&E, not sure of this fact? but I am informed that since our county hospitals came under Staffordshire its been a gradual decline in quality of services.
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nearly every week we read about terrible road conditions on the roundabouts and roads between Shrewsbury and Telford in this very paper – hope this is taken into consideration for the ambulances safe and speedy travel and not the ‘as the crow flies’ optimum travel that they will bandy about to convince themselves this is acceptable
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I think we get the message Andrew
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“PRH axe ‘is best move’”
For who, certainly not the people of Telford & East Shropshire. What planet are these people from, Telford has a growing population of 140,000, at some stage in the future may be classed as a city, and these idiots who run these hospitals in our, the taxpayers name, think it would be best to move A&E etc to Shrewsbury, a town with a population half the size. The people of Telford and East Shropshire won’t take this lying down and will fight all the way to retain FULL services at the PRH
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Crazy
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who cares about telfordians, they have access to Wolvehampton, people in the countryside are what really matters
waht we need is more private hospitals and less government and less taxes
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We fought for that hospital in the first place and pay our contributions for it….
….I’ll see you on the picketline!!!
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All of this because a bunch of bureaucrats’ decided to build the hospital on the wrong side of Telford, if the PRH had been built a bit further towards the Telford side of Wellington, would we still be having this debate?
Telford is an ever increasing community and we should be looking at putting more resources into the PHR to help deal with ambulance blocking etc, not moving the services to another equally stretched facility, where ambulances are bound to be blocked for longer periods due to the increase in patient numbers.
I agree with the majority of the comments posted, people will die if in an emergency everyone has to rush over to Shrewsbury. We are not just talking about critically ill Patients, but also about the fraught individuals rushing to get from Telford to see their loved ones perhaps for the last time, down roads that are already heavily used and at times very overcrowded, weekends and holiday periods for example, has anyone even bothered to look at this and the potential problems this will cause with yet more speeding vehicles rushing to get to the Welsh border.
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Instead of downgrading these hospitals why cant the so called top bosses take a pay cut instead of earning massive amounts of money sat on there backsides making these decisions, Even i could to do that.
Telford CANNOT AFFORD to lose these services..FACT.
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surely more people in telford get ill because its a poorer population, less active, more smokers, heart attacks etc ?
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I have to say that the trust’s recent statement sounds nothing like the exaggerated claims being made by Councillor Eade or the Sloppy Star.
I can’t help feeling that there has been some very irresponsible journalism which has been based on one person – Cllr Eade’s letter which in turn was based on rumours.
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So we’re in the wrong are we? MPs have spoken, as have councillors, and yet it’s the ‘Sloppy Star’ at fault.
Andrew Owen
shropshirestar.com
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Now and then this paper gets things VERY right – this is one of those times!
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Sorry Andrew did I rattle your cage?
I was stating the fact that the trust statement bears no relation to any article that your paper has published on the topic this week!
Rob are the articles you are referring to those about UFO’s. I fear it may be true that little green men may have performed a frontal lobotomy on Mr Owen?
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Yet again the conservatives are being blamed for what labour have cocked up,has anybody noticed that waiting lists have not dropped with all this so called money they have spent can anybody spell (pen pushers)same old labour.
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I criticise this newspaper as much as the next man but in this case I fully support their actions. Even if it was exaggeration the chance that the PRH could lose key services is reason enough to protest.
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My elderly mother has been taken to PRH A&E on several occations due to falls, and as she lives in a residential home they contact me to meet her at the hospital, every second counts and If I had to travel to RSH on my own early hours of the morning I would not feel confortable. The people of Telford need an A&E on our door step , with all these new housing estates being built in the area.
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As someone who works in the acute services(not in Shropshire) I would like to endorse the views of many people who have objected to the scaling down of some services at the Princess Royal.
I am from Shropshire and my family still live there. I am well aware of the difficulty faced by elderly relatives, who do not drive, in getting to hospital for appointments, treatment or as a visitor. I am also aware of the argument that specialist services are best delivered by specialist units who become more skilled at the procedures they carry out however I do not believe bigger is better and I cannot understand the decision to move acute services and A@E further away from the ever growing town of Telford with its busy road network. I hope the local people will object at every opportunity. Once services are lost they are very rarely returned
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With a large increase in the Telford population it is an outrage to downgrade the PRH.
Telford needs all its services to take care of the older and younger populations.
If A&E services are cut it will increase the death rates in Telford due to the distance needed to travel to Shrewsbury. How will people travel to Shrewsbury for treatment without an intergrated transport system older people will not bother traveling to Shrewsbury although this may benefit the pensions services.
Keep your hands off our PRH we paid for it with our stamp duties and income tax how dare you interfer.
Outraged Chris Poole
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In 1976 on Christmas Eve our 8 month old baby suffered a convulsion. The GP attended and told us to take him immediately up to Copthorne Hospital as it was then to the childrens ward.
It was snowing, an icy night and at 2am the roads were dangerous but in panic we risked our lives to get up there in double quick time. We thought we would never get there it seemed such a long way. On the journey he had three more seizures, and it was a terrible experience that I would not want any parents of a young child to have to go through. Telford is fast growing with a much bigger population and we need services here in Telford.
My grandson who sufferes from a rare gentic condition has to go into Birmingham Childrens Hospital for surgery next week, having to think about accommodation, travel expenses and car parking charges whilst you are there and add stress to an already difficult situation.
We must fight for our hospital in Telford and for services to be added not removed. For years we had to travel up the A5 to Shrewsbury and we deserve our hospital which was fought so hard for by the local people.
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i vote to keep PRH as it is – shrewsbury is to far in an emergency!!!!! stupid to to cut any hospital!!!!
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I repeat what I have already said – that if you do a population map of Shropshire (a) by residence and (b) by employment then you find from the first that the “centre” is nearer Telford than Shrewsbury, and on the second it is actually IN Telford.
So an A&E hospital on the west side of Shrewsbury accessed by a clogged bypass and a narrow lane is completely illogical!
It would be good to see an anlysis by the Trust of where their A&E patients for both hospitals came from (not in terms of residence but of location of accident/ambulance pick-up).
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Ridiculous!!!
Please do your homework before making these changes! TELFORD is a major town, has a HUGE population and more and more houses are to be built in the future as well as many already being built to date!! so why is it TELFORD does not need a MAJOR hospital? are the people that make these decisions totally brain dead? I can speak for many when i say that if through their negligent decision making people start to suffer worst still start dying through not getting treatment sooner, SOMEONE is going to sue big time, surely this will not be a quick money saver at all!
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Why should us in Telford loose our hospital it’s stupid we need it as Telford is bigger than shrewsbury!
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Three and a half years ago my wife collapsed at home and was rushed to the PRH,it was late evening and I went with her in the Ambulance,that night was a blur but around 2am i got to talk with Doctor who told me that if we’d have been another 10 mins later getting there then she would have died.
Because of her Illness she runs the risk of this happening again,imagine how she feels wondering if a death sentence might be being handed to her with the Extra traveling time to RSH A&E.
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Just wait for the few months, as before we will see demand up at both sites, patients waiting in corridors…
What about the people who depend on the PRH from outside Telford? like residents of Market Drayton and Newport, who already have journey times in excess of 20 minutes to hospital. The stark choice will be to attend Staffordshire Hospitals, which lets face it have massive problems of their own….
We lost our cottage hospitals with 24hr Minor Injuries, to make way for PRH and now they want to downgrade it!!!
I would like to say also, to the Staff that are at this moment are working at A/E, PRH that I and others will fight tooth and nail to keep full facilities at the PRH. What a morale boost to them having this above their heads…
The Officals including local doctors, should hang their heads in shame….
Absolutely disgraceful….
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it is not enough for telford politicians to bluster and blow, an independant candidate stood and won in Kiddie on this issue.Be warned crocodile tears are not enough, Telford is entitled to fair treatment and an election is on the horizon.
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As Members of Hadley & Leegomery Parish Council, my husband, John, and I raised the possibility of cuts to the services at PRH back in 1998. A chance meeting with a consultant brought to light the financial difficulties RSH had got them into because they had used capital funds for revenue purposes and couldn’t pay for repairs to the building. We were told that RSH were desperate to get their hands on PRH money as the latter was a well-run hospital who managed their finances.
We invited the Secretary of AHA to speak to the Parish Council and were given all the usual assurances that all was well.
Then came the joining of the trusts and sure enough, it wasn’t long before our problems began.
When I became Chairman of the Parish Council I did all I could to highlight the danger to us all from what I believed to be the predatory nature of the hierarchy at RSH who appear to have been the force major of hospital services. What Shrewsbury consultants want, they seem to get, and this has always been the case.
Subsequent speakers at our meetings have included Phil Holmer, who was given a hard time, Brian Taylor, Chairman of the PCT, Simon Connolly, Chief Exec of the PCT, and Tom Taylor himself, all of whom have persisted in trying to tell us that our FULL A&E service was safe.
Last December, John and I met Brian Taylor at a community event in Oakengates where he told me that I shouldn’t worry and make so much of the A&E issue as he would see to it that the PCT would ensure its future.
Apart from what I believe to be the undue influence of the Shrewsbury consultants, John and I are of the view that the problems were exacerbated by the fact that Phil Holmer is a member of the Labour Party as were the then MP for the Wrekin, the then Leader of Telford & Wrekin, the then Chairman of the PCT along with MP for Telford. It is an unwritten rule that no Member of the Labour Party will ever criticise or in any way speak out against a fellow member and in spite of private comments to me about the leadership of the hospital trust, none of them had the integrity or the courage to say a word in public. I could do nothing as to have repeated any of these conversations would have met with firm denials.
Our hospital has itself been a victim of the disease of party politics and other than continuing to warn local people about the danger, I could do no more and neither could those members of our parish council who have stood together to try to help.
After 11 years to say ‘I told you so’ is unhelpful so I won’t say it but I would give anything to have been wrong!
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My local hospital is essential – it is a safe haven for stray animals who need care! Ha – on a serious note it is important that a town the size of Telford has it’s own independant facilities, why should we have to waste valuable travelling time to Shrewsbury, it will inevitably cost someone their life!!
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Is everyone forgeting who gets the majority of these sick and dying patients to these both very busy hospitals the AMBULANCE SERVICE and has anyone thought of the complications, pressure and strain on resources any of these changes will have on an already struggling emergancy service… it is not just an arguement between Shrewsbury and Telford as obviously its not just these towns that are served by these hospitals….. Have a look at the Shropshire Map and think about each town and village on this map and where their residents go for treatment , it is un thinkable that the powers that be should think about closing either A/E departments, money should be found to extend and improve and develop both existing deapartments, and PRH should be given a decent Maternity service with a DR , a Head & Neck Department amongst others so that it can cope with every 999 emergancy….. why does this country and its goverment always have come up with these hairbrain ideas and never seem to try and fix the existing problems.
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In this 21st century both the RSH and PRH should provide the best possible healthcare. Please remember that we in the Oswestry area already have to travel 20 miles to the RSH.
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Absolutely Alistair #88.
People who keep making out that this is a simple matter of comparing the populations of Telford and Shrewsbury are naive to say the least.
As I have commented here before, the real issue is that the services are required at both hospitals and peoples efforts would be far better directed at making sure that this is the outcome rather than simply arguing about which one should go !
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This “shakeup” in NHS services as some of the national dailies report, is taking place countrywide. An even bigger shakeup is going to take place in Worcester 40 miles down the road where the people are similarly “up in arms”.
Ask yourselves the big question, why have all these announcements come at this split second in time. Some would have us think that they originate from the individual NHS Trusts, if this is the case, queer that they managed to all make their announcements at the same time.
This “shakeup” is centrally driven. Borrowed money has been thrown at the NHS for the past twelve years now it is “claw back” time, our countries debts are being called in.
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I live in Shrewsbury and support those in Telford fighting for their AandE service.
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Pat Smart’s comments above (85) indicates the problems that too often arise when political apppointees get involved in practical management – unless they have run a large organisation before or have worked as a manager in that field they can be run rings round. But they will cover each other’s backs to the end.
What it would be good to see published is what causes the financial difference between services at PRH, services at RSH or services at both.
Are there ‘peripheral agendas’ which could mean that additional costs are seen as necessary at PRH and benefits at RSH are over-stated?
Are these additional costs capital costs for rebuilding and re-equipping or are they running costs for staff, energy, consumables and maintenance?
Is there a staff reduction agenda whereby moving services will mean reduced medical and support personnel, leading to an overall drop in care standards, regardless of location?
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Do the Ambulance Service have enough resources available to them to reinstate journeys to RSH?
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Huw Peach said:
“I live in Shrewsbury and support those in Telford fighting for their AandE service. ”
It only seems to be politicians who are trying to turn it into a fight between the two communities. I live in Telford and am opposed to cuts at either hospital – both towns need adequate facilities, especially A & E
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We left the United Kingdom three years ago, because of rumors about future services and jobs at the PRH, So i am not surprised by the news on the shropshire star website about cuts at the PRH.
I believe that it should be the RSH that is downgraded or closed as it is old and now starting to show its age, Telford is a new modern hospital and still as at least another 30 or 40 years of use left in it,
Shrewsbury hospital may not have 10 years left in it, before its needs major funding to bring it upto modern standards.
My children were born at the RSH, And i would just like to say in its defence that there staff on the maternaty ward there are very professional and very good at there jobs and i feel they deserve a better hospital and better equipment to work with, than what they have at present, As Telford is only 15 minutes down the A5 it fits the bill perfect.
When my daughter was been born at the RSH a few years ago, The air conditioning system was not working so take this and a very hot summer, and it gets very unpleasant very quickly
The answer is simple keep Telford and upgrade it.
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This is all about funding and because the RSH is heavily subsidised by a ‘Foreign Government’ (Wales) Telford looses out. The fact that the RSH covers Wales, should not be taken into account. Wales is another country, if there is spare capacity availible then it can be used, but the merits of the two hospitals should be considered based on the English people they serve.
If this means the those over the boarder loose out then, thats one of those things. Sorry if that sounds mean, but do we get a free prescription if we cross the boarder to get it? No we don’t so Wales should not be allowed to affect decisions on our healthcare.
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The simple fact is that there should be one large acute hospital in Shropshire. Both PRH and RSH are too small and cannot maintain the full range of services around the clock. Those complaining about this would do better to campaign for a new build large acute hospital (pleas not PFI!!).
I for one would be happy to travel a further 20 minutes if that meant I would get high quality prompt service.
Those who are trying to turn this issue into Telford versus Shrewsbury and completely missing the point. I don’t believe this is about “cuts” as the press would like us to believe. This is about improving services for all of the population of Shrophire.
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i like the idea of a new build in between on the old a5, some where around Atcham would seem a sensible idea ?
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a, I agree somewhere around Atcham would be good.
The problem is paying for a new build hospital now that Gordon Brown has bankrupted the UK. Stopping the plan for ID cards would lead to some spare cash though …..
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I don’t support a new hospital in the middle of the countryside. For a start, it wouldn’t be very sustainable how else would people get their besides the car? It would be huge and have the effect of urbanising whatever part of the countryside it will be built in. There are only east-west links between Telford and Shrewsbury, those coming from the north or south would still have to go to one of the towns first.
If you ask me a new build between is worse for everyone while in one town or the other there will be at least one group who has improved services.
If a new hospital has to be built though I would suggest the former Sugar Beat factory site. Its a brownfield site at least.
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The SATH website (Trust Board Papers) contains much useful information regarding these possible changes (sath.nhs.uk).
A recent report publicised in the trust board papers questions the infrastructure in A & E at both sites (whilst praising staff) and I do wonder whether either hospital could become a major centre without considerable money being spent on buildings, car parking, etc.
Don’t let’s have a repeat of the acrimonious debates that resulted from the proposed move of ENT and consultant midwifery to Telford – can we all try and work together to get a plan that fits all the patients of Shropshire.
We should not forget the other major centre of care in the county either – the Robert Jones and Agnes Hunt Orthopaedic Hospital – who tend to get forgotten in any debate about care.
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I can’t help wondering if the option to keep both A & E departments open and moving and/or consolidating non emergency services at one or the other site has been considered? I would be interested to know the reason for rejection if this has been considered if anyone could enlighten me?
I think if you have a scheduled appointment then you can live with having to go an extra 20 mins because you are aware of it and can accommodate it (bit of a pain but sometimes life’s like that) however you cannot predict a major accident with serious casualties and could therefore do without having to fight traffic on the A5.
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When you look closely through the whole 2012/13 and the subsequent 2020 options the way the PCTs want thing to go is 2012/13 they do a half move to RSH and then 2020 EVERYTHING goes to RSH and PRH A&E becmes a minor injuries unit (that means cuts and bruises only!!!) It becomes obvious that the option of a new site is a red herring/smoke screen. It’s all in the CEOs report to the PCTs and SaTH board that the option of RSH as the ‘uber’-hospital for all Shropshire is the preferred move.
The problem is that the insistence on one super-quality A&E (and hospital) is a flawed argument in a large rural community. Major trauma and cases needing immediate emergency surgery (unlike on BBC’s Casualty) make up a fraction of cases seen at A&E. The vast majority of emergency cases that are life threatening can and are dealt with by level 2 A&E, which is what we have now. These are things such as heart attacks and heart failure, severe asthma attacks, strokes, etc. These conditions can kill people in less than 1/2 hour. A minor injury unit will not touch these life threatening conditions with a barge-pole, so your only option in 2020 if your one of the 200,000+ people living in East Shropshire will be to hope you survive all the way to RSH. There were a few seen at PRH this past week who would definitely not have survived the trip!!!
Shropshire is (I’m proud to say) a unique county. The powers that be are trying to impose a solution that involves centralising all services, that works in urban areas where your patients are close by. Shropshire is best served by two good hospitals that the majority of people can get to, rather than one super hospital that only a minority will get to!
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I think “InsidePerson” said it all in comment 103 – it’s a shame your name isn’t Taylor (it isn’t is it?) because you sound like you’d make a good Chief Exec!!!
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I understood that certain companies moved to Telford because a hospital needed to be within 15 minutes of their location. If we lose PRH facilities will those companies be forced to move away under Health and safety legislation?
Why are there only two options for voting?
Why is the PCT losing so much money?
Is an ‘uber’ hospital the only way to save money?
as usual too many questions and not enough answers.
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